Ole hyvä ja vastaa nopeasti kyselyyn Potkun kehittämisestä. Vastausten perusteella pohdimme keinoja uudistaa Potkua. Kiitos. :)

Jim Shortt vastaa

Löylyttelyä yli lajirajojen. Kaikkien kamppailulajien yhteisalue.

Ylipotkija: Valvoja

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#16

Viesti Sardaukar » elo 29, 2009, 08.28

Mjöllnir on dokumentit saanut ja tietääkseni ne oikeellisiksi todennut (tietysti, kun hänellä itsellään on aikalailla vastaavanlaista paperitavaraa).

- Nyt Jimbo voisi tietysti todistaa suoraselkäisyytensä ja näyttää vaikapa valvojille, että hänellä on British Army Discharge Papers a.k.a Red Book.

- Hän voisi myös selittää, miksi hän käyttää ensimmäisen ja toisen maailmansodan belgialaisia mitaleja? Tämähän ei tietysti ole laitonta, mutta varsin mautonta.

- Samoin, miksi hän on esiintynyt Brittiarmeijan laskuvarjojääkärisiivet takissaan, vaikka PCAU eli Parachute Course Administration Unit ei miestä tunne.

PCAU also maintain the tri-service database for all service parachutists. This database is consulted on an almost weekly basis by a variety of establishments seeking information for reasons ranging from pay entitlement to historical interest by veterans groups. This same data is regularly consulted by service police in cases of suspected fraud and/or non-entitlement to wear parachutist’s wings.

With electronic records dating back to 1967 and a card index back to the 1940s no one slips through the net.


Noilla voisi aloittaa. Eivätkä kysymykset aivan tähän lopu.


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#17

Viesti Sardaukar » elo 29, 2009, 15.21

Erikoista on myös miksi Jimbo koettaa kääntää asian siten, että häntä arvostelevilla olisi jotain IBA:ta vastaan? Ainakin pari tuntemaani ko. järjestöön kuuluvaa tai aikaisemmin kuulunutta ovat ihan asiallisia tyyppejä. Tietysti Jimbon omat asiat tottakai vaikuttavat ko. associationiin koska hän sitä johtaa, mutta sinänsä IBA:lla ei juurikaan ole asian kanssa mitään tekemistä.

Irlantilaisia kiinnostavat myös seuraavat asiat:

Miksi hän käyttää edelleen titteliä Baron of Castleshort, vaikka kyseisen arvon hänelle myöntänyt henkilö (Terence Francis MacCarthy) paljastettiin jo vuosia sitten huijariksi, hänen myöntämänsä "aatelisarvot" todettiin mitättömiksi ja hän joutui maanpakoon Irlannista? (ns. The MacCarthy Mór-skandaali).

Hän voisi myös toimittaa historiallista aineistoa ko. tittelin historiasta (Baron of Castleshort) ja edellisestä tämän arvonimen haltijasta, samoin ns. Royal Galloglass Guardin historiallisesta taustasta, koska sellaisia eivät historian tutkijat ole pystyneet löytämään.

Lisäksi, millä perusteilla ja keneltä hän on saanut luvan pukeutua puolisotilaalliseen uniformuun Irlannin tasavallassa ja oikeuden pitää hallussaan tuliaseita ko. maassa, olivat ne sitten deaktivoituja tai ei. Molempiin asioihin Irlannin tasavallan laki kun suhtautuu varsin nihkeästi.

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#18

Viesti Valvoja » elo 29, 2009, 19.14

Toimitaan niin, että tästä muodostuu keskustelu eikä kysymysten tulva. Täten antakaamme Jim Shorttin vastata aiempiin kysymyksiin ennen uusien esittämistä.

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#19

Viesti Sardaukar » elo 29, 2009, 19.33

Miten vain. Kysymyksiä kyllä riittää, odotamme vastauksia. :)

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#20

Viesti Valvoja » syys 2, 2009, 07.31

S_L kirjoitti: Onko Shortt jo vastannut tähän kysymkseen joka on Valvojan linkittämässä keskustelussa heti ensimmäisellä sivulla?
Were you ever a regular ( not TA) British Army soldier who had passed 22 SAS selection and were a "badged" Trooper/NCO in 22 SAS Regiment.

Were you ever in the TA SAS and if so did you pass TA SAS selection and were a "badged" Trooper/NCO in 21 or 23 SAS Regiment.

If you were NOT a Trooper/NCO in 21, 22 or 23 SAS Regiment, which if any, SAS unit did you serve in as someone who had passed selection ?
Jim Shortt vastasi näihin kysymyksiin.
32 years ago I was a Sgt Instructor ACF 114 det (badged Parachute Regt) based at 2 Coy 10 Para (Mitcham Rd). I was also recruited as a civilian instructor by Sgt Major Tom Laird (3 Para) when 3 coy PSI to teach bayonet fencing and unarmed combat and then later taught the same and did lectures for 10 Para at Aldershot and White City over a 2 year period at request of Captain David Lord (white city). I went on to join 21 SAS as a 'blanket stacker (I was by them an SRN) joining B Sqn (non sabre).

I left Oct 1980 and my no was 24550634. In 1982 I was asked by 1 Para at Redmond Bks to teach the same CQB, followed by AI PT CTCRM Lympstone and then also a HDCC Guards Depot (by Capt Tim Spicer) after vetitng I joined PRA at Aldershot and the Airborne brotherhood. Prior to going to Afghanistan I completed the Swedish Special Forces survival course under Lars Falt and went through their jump course and special forces selection getting both my maroon beret and Parachute-Ranger badge. I have also jumped with the 6th Bde Pomorska and gained Polish Wings, Latvian Special Forces wings and Israeli and not on the pay-as-you-jump routine claimed by Arrse. More than happy to send copies of the certs.

Like a number of nations the Legion of Frontiersmen (Countess Mountbatten's Own) use wings based on Brit (also Belgium/India/Pakistan/Ghana/Saudi to name a few). Although we have taken to putting a mural crown above it (where available) The Legion uses a Rust coloured beret somewhere between Airborne and RMP. I have been an LOF member (and officer) for 20 + years. I also, with MoD blessing was first westerner to visit the Soviet Airborne Forces (VDV) and Spetsnaz Officers Academy at Ryazan when it was still Soviet Union and not visitable. There I did elements of their training including jump training and earned my Guloboi (airborne blue) beret and Telenaishka shirt.

Like Prince Charles I did not do P Company at Aldershot, Unlike Prince Charles I did go through P Company with 21 SAS at Pontrilas with the milling done in the gym at the old Bradbury Lines in Hereford, but certainly did not attend No 1 PTS Brize Norton for BPS and more to the point have I never claimed to contrary to the claims of Arrser 'Sandy Boots' (real name Robert Sawyer).

I was never a member of 22 SAS ( regular army) of 'R; Sqn (TA) or 23 SAS (TA). I was never an officer in either the SAS or the Parachute Regiment. I was with 21 SAS and as a State Registered Nurse was invited to join their support element and was sent up from B Sqn 21 SAS by my OC Major Pat Tait to HQ Sqn and the Medical Room to Major (Dr) Ian Fraser. He and the other 2 doctors (Captains) were wearing Regiment beret and badge but all the rest of the personnel were wearing Regiment berets with RAMC badges. I was told I would have to do the same and badge as RAMC and lose the Regt Badge on my lid. When I was going to be sent to Ash Vale (RAMC depot) which was planned for after Ex Crusader in which 21 and 23 were Orange Forces. I left just before having fell foul of a TA Captain in Training wing. The plan to have me run a mini medical room at Lordship Lane was killed off.

I imagine the whole system is changed radically since then (1980) nearly 30 years ago. At B Block then Duke of Yorks HQ in Kings Rd Chelsea, London SW1 (21 SAS HQ & A Sqn) on the same evening I was in Med centre when prior to final Parade, head of OPs & Ints came in looking for people who could develop negative and print photos during challenger 80. I volunteered (I learn this at the Camera Club then off Charing X rd) and was told I would be borrowed by Op Ints. Just after Final Parade I was pulled by the Adjt who told me I would have to do selection and join the next selection. Not what I have signed up for, I had thought about doing selection eventually but in my own time frame, with better fitness and map reading skills.

When approached in 1979 by Dave Fleming (PSI B Sqn) I was invited to join as a medic, that was the deal, same with B Sqn OC Pat Tait. I told the Adjt it wasn't on. (I had a wife and child (my daughter Lucy), and had just learned we had another (my son Anthony) on the way and unlike most of dole patrol - a full time job. Adjt said he would relay that to Frank Smith in Training Wing. I was hauled out of the ranks Bar by HQ Sqn SMjr and told to report to Col Farnes. Frank Smith was there with Colonel Farnes and was told that my service would be terminated. Later Col Farnes spoke to me in the SF Club about 2 months later and in fact wrote me letter. His famous quote ' the regiment can be very incestuous'.

Repeatedly members past and present of 22 SAS would say to me about 21/23 - it is not the real deal, not SAS. I heard it from Dave Fleming and again from Paul Rice and Roger Cole.

During my short stint as a "blanket stacker" (non sabre personnel) with 21 SAS B sqn and then HQ, all 21 support staff (not Sabre Squadons) wore the Regiment beret and badge including the MT section drivers and the OPs and INts, Medical room people. Some medics after attending Ash Vale put an RAMC badge on instead of the SAS badge none of whom were Sabre. I remember at PATA (Pontrilas (I was not on selection just a body) the summer of 1980 those who passed TQ were paraded and given their cap badges, the rest of us were just issued beret and badge when I arrived at B Block (I was on B sqn's strength). The stable belt one bought at the mess bar (B Sqn at Lordship Lane had an all ranks bar). The Sabre lads wore SAS wings and if any support staff were airborne trained they wore ordinary parachute wings. I know all this pissed off the PSIs and 22 SAS was entirely different. I presume 23 were similar to 21 as I met some fellow 'blanket stackers' from the 23 SAS Sqns at Bradbury lines during my stint in the summer of 1980.

It may be different now but that was nearly 30 years ago. I still had contact with SAS Group in 1991 as can be seen by the letter from Major Joe Seeney from SAS Group after lectures I was asked to give to members of 21/22/23 SAS through the Intelligence Corps.
My membership of B Sqn 21 SAS was also commented up by my former Commanding Officer Colonel Keith Farned in the SAS regimental journal Mars & Minerva.
Sinulla ei ole tarvittavia oikeuksia nähdäksesi tämän viestin liitetiedostoja. Ole hyvä ja rekisteröidy tai kirjaudu sisään.

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#21

Viesti Valvoja » syys 2, 2009, 08.09

Jim Shortt vastaa Sardaukarin kysymyksiin:
In 1980 I received my discharge on a form B108d issued on 05th Nov from Infantry Manning & Records Office (South) based in Exeter. I have possession of the original. The Red Book he refers to was only for Regular soldiers. It is a total lie that I wear or wore WW1/WW2 medals. The medals I received and have certificates for were from the Belgian veterans organisations during my time as a Frontiersmen and up to the time I was Captain (officer commanding of C Squadron of the Legion of Frontiersmen of the Commonwealth (UK command). I have received 3 documented and certified medals from the Amicale de Roi Albert and Amicale Roi Leopold III, medal of commemoration King Badouin, Cross of Fidelity King Albert and the Cross of commemoration King Leopold III.

The Legion has a very close relationship with the Belgian military and veterans as the Legion provided a bodyguard for the King in WW1 and were part of the 3rd Belgian Lancers (now part of Belgian Para Commando Regt) in WW1 and were the first British troops to engage the Germans.

The British Army wear 'rank pips' so do a number of non military organisations like the Red Cross and St John's ambulance. Does that mean they are pretending to be British Army Officers?

Terence MacCarthy was recognised for 20 years under courtesy recognition (as was the case of all Irish Chieftains) by the Chief Herald's Office and recognised by 2 Chief Heralds during that period. The Irish Government to save money absorbed the Office of Chief Herald into the National Library so that Saudarkar's version of events are that of a self appointed expert called Sean Murphy (not a member of the recognised genealogists) who has been against the operations of the Herald's office for some considerable time. That version is posted on Arrse and supported by an Irishman called Ciaran O'Reilly who is a British Army aficionado and what Irish men call 'west-Brits' because of his support for things British. A bit like those disloyal Finns who would like to see Finland back as part of Sweden or Russia again.

There existed a courtesy recognition of Gaelic Chieftains titles from British Rule and there is a section in the 1917 Burkes peerage that lists these as self proclaimed but not having validity in British Law. The Irish government inherited the British records when the Irish Republic was proclaimed. Terence MacCarthy accepted the title under Gaelic laws of Tanistry not under the British and Irish Salic system (eldest son). This could only have been the case as his father and children of his elder brother were still alive. Recently the Irish minister of culture spoke in favour of using the Gaelic system as opposed to the English system.

Terence was recognised by both the clan MacCarthy Family and Royal MacCarthy Associations and supported by them even after withdrawal of courtesy recognition. Terence MacCarthy's courtesy recognition as the MacCarthy Mor (Prince of Desmond) was withdrawn by the Chief Herald's office and subsequently all courtesy recognition for Irish Titles were withdrawn and the Chief Heralds office stopped issuing grants of arms as this had been challenged as contrary to the wording of the Irish Constitution. This is still the case. Arrse expert Sean Murphy has claimed he 'exposed' Terence MacCarthy and caused the withdrawal of courtesy recognition. Not true. The then Chief Herald O Donoghue's (a librarian and civil servant with no formal heraldic and genealogical training) made the decision to withdraw recognition from Terence MacCarthy in 1999 was founded on Mr Paul Gorry's findings and not on a leak of information to a Sunday newspaper by Mr Murphy.

However, during the period he was the MacCarthy Mor and prior to his abdication and self-imposed exile in Morrocco he received confirmation from the Chief Herald's office that he was able to grant the hereditary gaelic lordships listed under his charge. One of those is Castleshort of which University College Cork Historical department list 1 in Kerry and 5 in Cork in the former kingdom of the MacCarthy Mors. This is also listed in history of The MacCarthy Mor's written in 1912 by Samual Trant MacCarthy. I was recognised by Terence MacCarthy (during his time as The MacCarthy Mor, Prince of Desmond) as The Baron of Castleshort. That document is viewable in Gaelic and references are also available in English. I am also recognised as chief of my clan by the Irish government established Clans of Ireland and Clans of Ulster.

That my family MacAnghearre (translated as Shortt from the Gaelic were Galloglas can be found in many Irish and Scottish books. For example: Padraigh Mac Giolla-Domhnaigh in 1923 published through the Gael Co-operative society 'Some Anglicised Surnames in Ireland' , He wrote SHORTT/SHORT: These 2 names are the anglicised names of McGirr (transliteration of MacAnghearre) in the areas of Omagh and Clogher in County Tyrone and in County Armagh. The MacGirrs were galloglasses in Ulster of Scots' origin. Another pointer is that the only other Shortt/Short families in Irish genealogy were Cromwellian Protestant planters descended from a John Shortt (Puritan settler in County Laois). The Gaelic families were catholic even during the oppression called 'the Penal Laws ' which forbade Irish Catholic's property and position. A respected Irish genealogist has taken my direct line back to the Eighteenth century. Long before such laws were finally repealed in the 19th century: (Penal Laws:Among the discriminations catholic faced as victims of the Penal Laws were: Exclusion from membership in either the Irish Parliament or the British Parliament; Exclusion from voting; Severe property restrictions, notably the ability of any member of the Church of Ireland to seize property from any Catholic, without compensation; the ability of any landlord to raise rents without restriction, and to evict at will.

The family came to Ireland from Scotland pre Tartan period so there is no recorded tartan available so I wear the tartan of my mother's clan Ui Faircheallaigh registered in 1875 as a tartan.

Saudaukar is not an expert on Irish history he quotes the Arrse poster Gallowglass (Ciaran O Reilly). In turn Sean Murphy who is quoted by Arrse poster who calls himself Gallowglass (Ciaran O Reilly, Murphy's one time student of a Murphy's part time family history course at UCD) created and leads his own Centre for Irish Genealogical and Historical Studies. A grandiose title for a 1 man band as opposed to the recognised body which is Association of Professional Genealogists in Ireland which also advises the Chief Herald's Office.

BACKGROUND. Mr Sean J Murphy's on line contributions reveal that he has been excluded from consultancy work in the Irish Government Genealogical Office/ Office of Chief Herald of Ireland since 1993 'on account of his difficulties both with the Genealogical Office and the Association of Professional Genealogists in Ireland'. Mr Murphy also parted company with the Association of Professional Genealogists in Ireland (APGI) around 1993. He asserted that he had been excluded, but a prominent member of APGI asserts that he left
of his own accord. We note that a distinguished member of APGI was appointed, relatively recently, to the Board of the National Library of Ireland and to its Committee on Genealogy and Heraldry and that another prominent member of APGI is a member of the same Committee.

Mr Murphy has been excluded from consultancy contracts in the Irish Government Genealogical Office/ Office of Chief Herald of Ireland since 1993 and staff training courses he conducted in the National Library of Ireland were discontinued 1997.)
Following his 'exclusion' from contract work in the Genealogical Office/ Office of Chief Herald, Mr Murphy obtained a staff training contract in the National Library of Ireland, however, when it ended in 1997 it was not renewed. Mr Murphy asserts (rec. heraldry 7 Jan 2007) that in 1997 'the new man' in charge of the Library /Office of Chief Herald declined to continue his 'contract work for the Library and famously sneered that he was the self-appointed saviour of Irish genealogy'. Mr Murphy also asserts that he was responsible for 'exposing' Terence Mac Carthy, the Mac Carthy Mór, via a leak to a Sunday newspaper, however, a leading UK Genealogist/ Heraldist, Mr Cecil R Humphery-Smith, OBE, Principal of the Institute of Heraldic and Genealogical Studies, Canterbury, gives a different version of events.

Murphy claims to be an expert on Irish Chieftains, yet An Office of Chief Herald of Ireland memo dated August 6, 1999, stipulates that a consultant genealogist member of the Association of Professional Genealogists in Ireland, competent in Irish/Gaelige, would be required to examine the Mac Sweeney Doe petition for recognition. Mr Murphy (self-designated specialist) is not a member of APGI and he does not hold a significant professional qualification in Irish/Gaeilge. Mr Murphy informs (via his web site) that he has been excluded from consultancy work in the Irish Government Genealogical Office since 1993 and that staff training courses he conducted in the National Library of Ireland were discontinued in 1997 and not resumed despite his plea that he is 'ready to resume training National Library staff if given an opportunity to do so'. Mr Murphy believes that his exclusion from consultancy work is due to his 'difficulties both with the Irish Government Genealogical Office and the Association of Professional Genealogists in Ireland'. Mr Murphy disclosed, 17 May 2006, that his 'Centre for Irish Genealogical and Historical Studies' has been active 'for more than a decade', that it is not a commercial business, does not charge fees and has no staff. However, Mr Murphy omitted to mention that seven years ago he had another 'Centre', i.e., his one-man 'Centre for Irish Genealogical and Local Studies', active 1999 and still on-line. Evidence re the existence of that Centre is recorded in an extract from an Office of Chief Herald letter, dated 5 July 1999, which Mr Murphy obtained under the Freedom of Information Act and posted on his web site, 30 Sept 2001. The extract states: 'Murphy is the self-appointed saviour of Irish genealogy, now calling himself the 'Centre for Irish Genealogical and Local Studies' ... one of the most difficult and unpleasant characters I have had to deal with. .. he has got access to all the information he is entitled to and more ...' Mr Murphy informs us that the letter was written by Mr Brendan O Donoghue, a highly regarded and distinguished member of the Irish Civil Service, who retired from his post as Secretary General of the Department of the Environment and was appointed Director of the National Library of Ireland and Chief Herald of Ireland, 1997.

Mr Cecil R Humphery-Smith, Principal of Canterbury Institute of Heraldic and Genealogical Studies, arguably the best qualified and most respected name in Heraldic and Genealogical scholarship in the U.K., has taken Mr Murphy to task for alleged 'misrepresentation of facts' re the recognition of Terence MacCarthy as 'Mac Carthy Mór'. Mr Humphery-Smith has explained in his letter that Mr Fergus Gillespie, present Chief Herald of Ireland, had not been requested to examine the Mac Carthy Mór pedigree and that he signed the recognition document 'Per Pro' on behalf of Mr Begley, Chief Herald of Ireland, when instructed to do so by Mr Begley. Mr Humphery-Smith has called on Mr Murphy to apologize: (a) to Mr Brendan O Donoghue (former Chief Herald of Ireland); (b) to Mr Fergus Gillespie (present Chief Herald of Ireland); (c) to the Office of the Chief Herald of Ireland.

Mr Humphery-Smith draws attention to the fact that Mr Murphy's 'Centre for Irish Genealogical and Historical Studies' has no staff (other than Sean Murphy) and no members and has no connection with the Office of Chief Herald of Ireland. Mr Cecil R Humphery-Smith has been named the 'Father of Family History' and has a veritable alphabet of academic qualifications and literary honours and awards after his name - which he rarely uses. He is one of few to receive the much coveted Gustav Von Numers Prize for heraldic art and design and has long been the only British member of the Council of L'Académie Internationale d'Heraldique. His work on the heraldry of Canterbury Cathedral was acknowledged by the award of the D'Altenstein prize, 1961, and he was awarded the Prix Dalenda in 1991 for his advancement of medieval historical and genealogical research. Queen Elizabeth, in acknowledgement of his outstanding contribution to Heraldic and Genealogical scholarship over many years, awarded him an OBE in 2004. Mr Cecil R. Humphery-Smith is Principal of the Institute of Heraldic and Genealogical Studies, Canterbury.

The following item (posted by a contributor to rec.heraldry 6 Nov 2007) gives background information concerning Mr Murphy's relationship with the Genealogical Office/ Office of Chief Herald of Ireland and the Association of Professional Genealogists in Ireland. 'I mentioned Sean (Murphy)'s vendetta a week back in a different context, and would like to point out that my comments are not based on any great claim I may have as a mind reader, but on Sean's own comments. As you will have noticed by now, Sean has a penchant for repetition, especially about his role with regard to Terence MacCarthy, et al. [For quite a different take on the latter issue, see Mr C. R. Humphery-Smith's letter published in the Coat of Arms, pp 246-48, (2004)]. However, one point Sean has not been so keen to repeat as of late is the basis for his animosity towards the GO (=Genealogical Office) and CHI (=Chief Herald of Ireland). In former times, though, Sean was not so reticent. When Sean first reached the shores of rec.heraldry he informed us that he had been snubbed by the GO/CHI back in the early 1990's, and was also in dispute with the Association of Professional Genealogists in Ireland (of which, of course, he is not a member). In addition to posting here about his being snubbed professionally, Sean also had similar comments on his home page, which seem to have been quietly removed. So, for those with a long enough memory there is no great secret here, Sean is motivated by the desire for revenge.'

In addition to MacCarthy Mor, Sean Murphy has attacked the legitimacy of at least 3 other Irish Chieftains of the name - The O'Long, The Maguire and the MacSweeney Doe. He has been proven wrong in every case, but has refused to apologise. A person intent on damaging reputations should check the validity of his allegations, and particularly so, when he claims that he is 'a scholar, 'a specialist', and 'a chiefly pedigree expert second to none'

A bit long winded but unlike Arrse, If I say some one is a liar or mistaken I prove my point with facts not character assassination which is the method of the exiled Finn who hides behind the moniker of Saudaukar (an apt name as it is a fictional army from a science fiction novel). When we totally uncover Saudaukar's identity we will name him. He is a liar when he says he does not have my lawyer's name, it has been posted on Arrse and he has posted about him: My lawyer is Thomas Baldwin of Baldwin Legal of Marino Mart, Fairview Dublin. And if Saudaukar wishes to write to him under his real name with his own lawyer's address I would welcome it.

regards,
JI

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#22

Viesti Sardaukar » syys 2, 2009, 08.44

Hyvin mielenkiintoista. :D Tuossa ei nyt ole mitään uutta. Hänellä ei siis ole Brittien Armeijan palvelustodistusta eli Red Book-asiakirjaa? Letters of Appreciation eivät ole ihan sama asia kuin palvelustodistus ja ovat kiitoksia pidetyistä kursseista.
Lieneekö tuo discharge document saatavilla ja voisiko hän esim. näyttää sen vaikkapa sivuston moderaattoreille? Voi olla hyvin valaiseva dokumentti? 8-) Erikoista on myöskin, kuka hänelle on ko. siipiä myöntänyt, PCAU ei tunne häntä edelleenkään.

Itsellenikin on kapiaisaikana pitänyt useampikin siviili erilaisia kursseja...ja tämä ei tee heistä sotilaita vaikka ovat mnulle kursseja pitäneet.

Army Cadet Force on Brittiarmeijan sponsoroimaa partiolaistoimintaa nuorille, eikä siellä Adult Instructorina toimiminen tee miehestä sotilasta. Myöskään erilaisiin associationeihin kuuluminen ei tee hänestä sotilasta. SAS Association onkin myös kysynyt, milloin hän palauttaa heidän jäsenkorttinsta, se kun olisi pitänyt palauttaa heti vierailun päätyttyä?

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#23

Viesti JanneM » syys 2, 2009, 09.07

Mikäli mä tuota nopeasti lukaisemalla jotain sain selvää, niin hänhän selkeästi kertoo, että "The Red Book he refers to was only for Regular soldiers." Eli että häne ei ole ollut sotilas... Ei kai tuosta asiasta sen enempää?

Jahka jaksan lukea tuon kunnolla kokonaan, niin ehkäpä minullekkin herää lisäkysymyksiä herra Shorttille.
Minua kiinnostaisi tässä tapauksessa eniten ne jujutsu jutut ja hänen paronin arvonsa. Olisi mielenkiintoista tietää niistä lisää.
-Janne Maunonen-
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#24

Viesti Elina » syys 2, 2009, 09.08

Paronin arvoahan tuossa vastauksessa on pitkälti nimenomaan käsitelty...

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#25

Viesti JanneM » syys 2, 2009, 09.23

Eli hyvinpä luin. :lol:
Pitää josain vaiheessa kahlata kunnolla.
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#26

Viesti Sardaukar » syys 2, 2009, 13.53

Koska Jim on ystävällisesti toimittanut myös ARRSElle todistuksen siivistään, jotka on myöntänyt Yhdysvaltalainen organisaatio nimeltään "International Association of Airborne Veterans". Kyseinen organisatio järjestää/järjesti Pay-As-You -Drop-laskuvarjohyppytapahtumia ulkomaisten sotilasyksiköiden avustuksella.

Kyseisessä "certifikaatissa" mainitaan selkeästi maat, joissa hänelle on myönnetty laskuvarjojääkärisiivet. Dokumentissa on ensimmäisenä mainittu UK. Kuitenkaan Brittien asevoimat eivät ole hänelle ko. merkkiä myöntäneet, vaikka hänen on useissa kivissa nähty sellaista kantavan. Otaksuimme tietysti, että hän pystyisi osoittamaan ko. Brize Nortonin kurssin käymisen, koska kyseiset siivet ansaitaan vain ko. kurssin kautta.

Joten, voimme jo miehen kertoman mukaan havaita, että hänen sotilaallinen taustansa rajoittuu 171 päivän palvelukseen 21 SAS -rykmentin riveissä. Tästä laskemalla, koska he järjestävät koulutustilaisuuksia joka toinen viikonloppu sekä yhtenä iltana viikossa, hän on maksimissaan viettänyt 12 viikonloppua ja 24 iltaa ko. yksikön koulutuksessa. Maksimissaan, osallistuttuaan kaikkiin mahdollisiin ko. koulutustapahtumiin, hän on ollut yhteensä 27 päivää Ison-Britannian asevoimien rivissä.

Saamiemme tietojen mukaan hänen poistumisensa yksikön riveistä tapahtui nimikkeellä SNLR (Service No Longer Required). Ilman yksikön peruskoulutuksen suorittamista ei oikein voi kauheasti mainostaa olevansa sotilas, ei missään Ison-Britannian asevoimien yksikössä.

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#27

Viesti JanneM » syys 2, 2009, 14.11

Kyllä mä näkisin, että pappi on pappi, lääkäri on lääkäri ja lotta on lotta vaikka olis minkälaiset kulmaraudat kauluksessa. Ja hyvä niin. Kyllä kaikille noille tehtäville on käyttöä puolustusvoimissa niin täällä kun muuallakin.
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#28

Viesti Mika » syys 2, 2009, 14.41

Sardaukar kirjoitti:
Mjölnir kirjoitti:Onko määräaikaisessa virassa palveleva reservin upseeri tai -aliupseeri sotilas? Entä sotilasvirkamies? Entä sotilaspappi? Entä Kenttäsairaanhoitaja?
Jos on nimitetty sotilasvirkaan, tällöin on sotilas.
Okei, näkemyksemme eroavat aika lailla. Minusta sotilasvirka tarkoittaa lähinnä kapiaista eli kantahenkilökuntaan kuuluvaa, mutta ei sotilasta. Sotilas on SA-Intin puitteissa minun näkökantani mukaan henkilö, joka on käynyt monivuotisen, kokopäivätoimisen koulutuksen, josta nykyään vastaa Maanpuolustuskorkeakoulu. Mutta tämä on vain minun käsitykseni. Pitääkin väärinkäsitysten välttämiseksi jatkossa aina vähän tarkistella, mitä kukin missäkin yhteydessä sotilaalla tarkoittaa.
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#29

Viesti Pauli » syys 2, 2009, 14.57

Mika kirjoitti: Sotilas on SA-Intin puitteissa minun näkökantani mukaan henkilö, joka on käynyt monivuotisen, kokopäivätoimisen koulutuksen, josta nykyään vastaa Maanpuolustuskorkeakoulu. Mutta tämä on vain minun käsitykseni. Pitääkin väärinkäsitysten välttämiseksi jatkossa aina vähän tarkistella, mitä kukin missäkin yhteydessä sotilaalla tarkoittaa.
Eikö mielestäsi sotilasammattihenkilöt sitten ole sotilaita? Tai sopimussotilaat?
Aika jännä kriteeri sotilaalle jos korkeakoulututkinto on se mikä tekee sotilaasta sotilaan :|

Omasta mielestäni jopa varusmiehet ovat sotilaita. Sopparin tai viranpuolesta leikkivistä puhumattakaan (oli sitä "korkeaa koulutusta" tahi ei).

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#30

Viesti Mjölnir » syys 2, 2009, 15.15

Suomessahan sotilaita ovat rikoslain 45 Luvussa 27§ mainitut henkilöt, mutta josko se on jotenkin erilaista esimerkiksi yhdistyneissä kuningaskunnissa, sitä en tiedä.

edit:
Sotilaalla tarkoitetaan tässä luvussa:

1) puolustusvoimien sotilasvirassa palvelevaa sekä sitä, joka on nimitetty puolustusvoimien virkamieheksi määräaikaiseen virkasuhteeseen määrättynä sotilastehtävään;

2) asevelvollisuuttaan aseellisena tai aseettomana suorittavaa tai asevelvollisuuslain (1438/2007) 79 §:ssä tarkoitetussa palveluksessa olevaa sekä naisten vapaaehtoisesta asepalveluksesta annetussa laissa (194/1995) tarkoitettua palvelusta suorittavaa; (28.12.2007/1441)

2 a) vapaaehtoisesta maanpuolustuksesta annetun lain (556/2007) 18 §:ssä tarkoitettua puolustusvoimien vapaaehtoisissa harjoituksissa palvelevaa ja lain 21 §:ssä tarkoitettua kouluttajaa ja kouluammuntojen johtajaa; sekä (11.5.2007/563)

3) puolustusvoimissa sotilasvirkaan koulutettavaa oppilasta.

Sotilaita koskevia säännöksiä sovelletaan lisäksi rajavartiolaitoksessa sotilastehtävissä palveleviin sekä sotilaallisesta kriisinhallinnasta annetussa laissa (211/2006) tarkoitetussa kriisinhallintakoulutuksessa, -harjoituksissa ja -palveluksessa oleviin niin kuin siitä laissa erikseen säädetään. (31.3.2006/214)

Tämän luvun säännöksiä sovelletaan lisäksi vapaaehtoisesta maanpuolustuksesta annetun lain 23 §:ssä tarkoitettuihin puolustusvoimien virka-aputehtäviin osallistuviin vapaaehtoisiin siten kuin siitä erikseen säädetään kyseisessä laissa. (11.5.2007/563)
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